This report comes from OneNewsNow and appeared yesterday:
Well, that's bleeping brilliant, now isn't it? We've had troops in these Taliban-run hellholes for.... how many years has it been now? - ostensibly "keeping the peace" and trying to return some semblance of sanity to a volatile, satanically-controlled region, a soldier has God's Word sent to him from his church halfway around the world, and our own military destroys the Bibles so as not to give offense. Sheer genius. By all means, let's keep out the Gospel. Wouldn't want to be all "politically incorrect" now, would we? Who knows what exposing these brainwashed genocidal maniacs to Christianity might do.
The U.S. military is confirming that it has destroyed some Bibles belonging to an American soldier serving in Afghanistan.Reuters News says the Bibles were confiscated and destroyed after Qatar-based Al Jazeer television showed soldiers at a Bible class on a base with a stack of Bibles translated into the local Pashto and Dari languages. The U.S. military forbids its members on active duty -- including those based in places like Afghanistan -- from trying to convert people to another religion.
Reuters quotes Maj. Jennifer Willis at the Bagram Air Base, north of Kabul, who said "I can now confirm that the Bibles shown on Al Jazeera's clip were, in fact, collected by the chaplains and later destroyed. They were never distributed."
According to the military officials, the Bibles were sent through private mail to an evangelical Christian soldier by his church back home. Reuters says the soldier brought them to the Bible study class where they were filmed.
The Chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff, Admiral Mike Mullen, told a Pentagon briefing Monday that the military's position is that it will never "push any specific religion."
This poll ran as part of the article:
Results from our related poll
What's your reaction to the decision by the U.S. military
to destroy the soldier's Bibles?
12 comments:
If you don't agree with the U.S. war against terror, why not be up front about it? We didn't go to Afghanistan to convert people to Christianity. Attempts to push Christianity in Afghanistan has proven to be a sure path to disaster for superpowers over the past 200 years.
The safety of the United States, which guarantees our right to believe as we choose, should take precedence in this case. Illegal Bibles that endanger our nation's security do not deserve special protection. Save the Christian, not the book.
The issue at hand has nothing to do with whether or not I personally support the war on terror, (which I do, btw) so that is a red herring. Steven Dale Green's rape and murder of the Iraqi girl and her family was an evil and heinous act. Saying so does not imply involvement in Iraq is not a just war.
Bibles do not endanger our national security, and you know it. Extreme Islamic terrorism does. Notwithstanding this fact, the detainees at Gitmo had Korans and access to Muslim clerics. Destroying a soldier's private property is questionable to begin with; destroying Bibles is indefensible. "Pushing" Christianity is a mere smokescreen justification for what was an unjustifiable (although 'politically correct') action. I would argue that an ex-superpower "pushing" the godless ideology of communism catalyzed a more sure path to disaster in Afghanistan than Christianity ever has. Most of the missionaries who have been brave enough to set foot in that country have been working to improve the health care and water supply in order to meet basic humanitarian needs.
Destroying the Bibles was a reprehensible act with absolutely no moral or political rationale.
I watch the cable news show called "Mosaic: news from the middle east" everyday.
They claim to be giving the muslim viewpoint that the western media ignores, and this is true, but in fact they only expose their blind hatred, esp for Israel.
That is where I first saw this story and they were livid at the idea that bibles were being brought into a muslim country, and yet, they will also insist that the building of Saudi funded mosques and madrasas in the US and the west is their divine right as muslims.
The situation is a difficult one. I would hope that the chaplain involved would have been more tactful, but the hypocrisy of the muslims is appalling.
Dani'el,
Did you see any of the news coverage about the private Saudi grade school in Washington DC? They smuggled some textbooks out and had them translated - the propaganda is frightening. The curriculum is essentially training the students in jihad (war against 'pigs' and 'dogs'). Since you're a Christian of the Hebraic persuasion, I guess that makes you both. Anyway, one of thew textbooks even had detailed instructions on amputating the foot and the hand (on alternating sides) of a victim. This is endorsed by sharia law. The school, of course, does not allow improptu visits by the govt. They need at least a month's notice. Hmm.
This evil indoctrination is going on right here in the USA, a few miles from the capital, in the name of democracy. The double standard is astounding. In a spiritual sense, I realize this is to be expected - but in the temporal...terrorists are being bred right here on American soil.
Yes, I have Marie.
In addition to all the Jihad camps that dot the landscape from coast to coast, or the tax funded islamic school in MN etc.
It is madness and the fulfillment of prophecy.
Dan 2:43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.
Marie, you are aware -- are you not? -- that the founding incident for al Quaeda's war on the U.S. was the U.S.'s presence in Gulf War I, in Saudi Arabia? The Wahabi sect Osama bin Laden follows were upset that Americans had brought even their own scriptures, without trying to convert anyone.
If these soldiers were spreading Bibles, on their time or on duty, it equally endangers our soldiers and the mission.
Yes, we give even prisoners access to their own scriptures. That doesn't mean others will necessarily offer us the same treatment, either way.
The most troubling aspect was not the presence of a Bible, but the fact that they were intended to be used as instruments of conversion. Surely you recall the incidents where Afghanis were sentenced to death for converting to Christianity.
Putting our nation at risk was close to a terrorist act. Your defense of the action is really quite shocking.
It was unfortunate. I doubt most of the soldiers involved realized the depth of the danger they posed. They disobeyed orders. In wartime that can be cause for treason charges.
Jesus didn't ask us to return to Moslems blow for blow. Jesus never asks us to convert by the sword. Jesus does not ask us to kill our enemies or to unnecessarily endanger Christians to get the Word out. I'm curious: On what basis do you defend these soldiers' disobeying orders and risking the mission of the U.S.? Surely you had not thought this through. Yes, generally destruction of scripture is shocking. This case has other circumstances that should be considered.
Have you ever been a missionary, or supported missionaries in the field? Is there any mission program that calls for insulting other religions as part of a Christian program? I've never heard of one.
The Wahabi sect Osama bin Laden follows were upset that Americans had brought even their own scriptures, without trying to convert anyone.This would indicate, would it not, that said Wahabi sect is a fanatic theocracy run by paranoid Islamo-fascists? Or, simply put, the problem was in their own minds if they had an issue with ex-pats bringing Scriptures for private use. This example only further proves my point – that the evil was (and is) perpetrated entirely by the Muslim side and was not instigated by Bible-reading Christians.
The most troubling aspect was not the presence of a Bible, but the fact that they were intended to be used as instruments of conversion. Surely you recall the incidents where Afghanis were sentenced to death for converting to Christianity.
Ironically enough, as I type this, Dr. Emir Caner is on TV with John Ankerburg discussing his Muslim father’s hysterical reaction when he converted to Christianity. Thugs at his family’s mosque were instructed to beat him up. Yes, Afghanis, Saudis, Pakistanis and converts of many other nationalities are sentenced to death for conversion – American missionary social workers were imprisoned for owning a copy of the Jesus Film. A Pakistani native evangelist spoke at our church last year – he has scars all over his legs from the power drills the used to torture him for preaching the Gospel. And you know what? People are coming to Christ in droves. Throughout the entire course of Church history, when the Church has been most severely persecuted, it has grown the fastest and been the purest (unwavering devotion of the Body to Christ). So I’m not really sure what your point is. Stop sharing the Gospel because it might be dangerous? Jesus warned us it would be – He specifically said something about floggings, beatings, putting out of houses of worship, and executions. (John 16:2; Matt. 10:17). “Instruments of conversion” do not exist. Only the Holy Spirit can convert an unregenerate heart, and God speaks to us through His Word (whether or not you choose to accept it). The fact that His Gospel is powerful enough to do so is documented in cases such as Kaing Guek Eav, the former Khmer Rouge torturer who gave His life to Christ.
Putting our nation at risk was close to a terrorist act.Oh, I agree. Which is why I think Hamas-supported mosques (like one here in MA under scrutiny) and Wahabi-funded terrorist schools, like the one in DC where kids are taught to hate, are shocking in the extreme. Politicians cozying up to the Islamic leaders (especially the ones who deny the Holocaust) are the real traitors. Distributing Bibles, no matter how you try to vilify it, can in no way be misconstrued as dangerous, treacherous, or insubordinate. Christianity does not pose a threat to national security. (I’m finding it hard not to laugh at the irony of your comments as I type this).
Jesus didn't ask us to return to Moslems blow for blow. Jesus never asks us to convert by the sword. Jesus does not ask us to kill our enemies
Agreed. None of which was being done by any Christian in question (although Islam has historically employed ALL of these methods of forced conversion, along with impalement for those who refuse…and continues to do so today).
or to unnecessarily endanger Christians to get the Word out.“Unnecessarily” is a subjective term, but He made it clear that many would be required to lay down their lives for the sake of the Gospel. Regardless, you are again shooting in the dark because no one was endangered in this case.
On what basis do you defend these soldiers' disobeying orders and risking the mission of the U.S.?They weren’t “risking the mission of the U.S.”, so the question reads a bit like “Your honor, do you still beat your wife?” The soldier’s property (the Bibles in question) were in no way at odds with the political mission of the United States government (which, by the way, guarantees freedom of religion in the First Amendment of the Constitution). If you think the same action would have been taken with a stack of Korans, you are delusional. However, unlike the Koran, the Bible does not endorse killing members of other religions on the grounds that they are “infidels”. Christ was notoriously a-political, as was Paul. So even on examination of the actual biblical content, one cannot come up with anything that would thwart the U.S.’s political ambitions in the country.
Have you ever been a missionary, or supported missionaries in the field?
Yes, on both counts. I was a missionary in Bulgaria (hence my knowledge of the Muslim Ottoman Empire’s atrocities in the Balkans), and support two GFA missionaries in India, a country with much violence and persecution. (None of it instigated by the Christians, by the way, who suffer the brunt of Muslim and Hindu extremist attacks). I also support a native missionary in Belarus, which under the regime of Lukashenka hhas reverted to a police state where Christianity is illegal. Freedom of religion is non-existent, and the KGB harasses my friend continuously. Bibles and proselytizing are illegal today in Belarus, but Olga and others like her do it anyway. The results are not “threats to national security” – very often, they are more like this:
- teenaged girls leave prostitution
- teenaged boys leave or resist organized crime rings
- drunkards stop drinking
- thieves stop stealing
- families are salvaged and babies are adopted
- LIVES ARE CHANGED FOR THE BETTER.
Is there any mission program that calls for insulting other religions as part of a Christian program?Nah, the Muslims seem to have a monopoly on the “insulting other religions” market. Did you know that Wahabi missionaries (mostly from Saudi Arabia) are Building mosques and opening propaganda camps schools all over Albania, the former Yugoslavia, Turkey and Bulgaria? Villages in nations that never cared much about religion before have now spawned quite a few passionate Muslim activists. Maybe I should soon devote a full blog entry to the church burnings and riots that have taken place in Kosovo and else where in the former Yugoslavia. Despite the history of Islam’s religious intolerance, virulent hatred and violence, in parts of the Balkans it is currently easier to build a mosque than it is a church. (Three Bulgarian pastors expressed this concern to me when I was in Sofia last summer doing interviews).
Thanks for stopping by and sharing your thoughts, Ed.
Ed: "you are aware -- are you not? -- that the founding incident for al Quaeda's war on the U.S. was the U.S.'s presence in Gulf War I, in Saudi Arabia?"
I'm not sure the facts bear this out. According to wikipedia, bin Laden got his start fighting Soviets in Afghanistan. When he didn't get what he wanted from the "freedom fighters" there, he split (1988) and started al Qaeda, already a noted jihadist. When Iraq invaded Kuwait, he offered his support to Saudi Arabia. They refused his offer. That is what made him hate the West so much. Of course, stationing "infidel" troops there only made it worse.
Here's the problem. Christians are called to share the Gospel. That is one of the absolutely clearest commands we are given. We are Christians first and fathers, mothers, workers, soldiers, Americans, or anything else second. It may be dangerous to share the Gospel in some of the places we go, but to not share the Gospel where we go would put us at odds with the One we claim to follow ... a nonsensical position to take. We are told, "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell" (Matt 10:28). When commanded by the authorities to stop preaching the Gospel, Peter and John had only one simple answer: "Whether it is right in the sight of God to give heed to you rather than to God, you be the judge; for we cannot stop speaking about what we have seen and heard" (Acts 4:19-20).
Whether it is right in the sight of God to give heed to the American military rather than to God, you be the judge.
Whether it is right in the sight of God to give heed to the American military rather than to God, you be the judge.They took an oath to God to heed the military in this case. There is no question but that they, if they are Christian, owe this duty to the U.S.
Where does Jesus tell anyone to disobey a direct order of a superior designed to protect the security of the people? Nowhere.
If these Christians can't be counted on to carry out the oath they swore, they should be court-martialed and jailed. As the Supreme Court ruled in 1931, anyone who can't defend their nation because they think God tells them not to, isn't fit for citizenship. While no one will strip them of their citizenship, and the Constitution protects their right to be lunatics, their having sworn an oath to act differently should bind them.
Are you a U.S. citizen, by the way? Have you ever taken the oath to uphold and defend the Constitution and U.S.? Did you cross your fingers when you did that?
Where does Jesus tell anyone to disobey a direct order of a superior designed to protect the security of the people? Nowhere.
Given that the soldier in question did not disobey a direct order designed to protect the security of any people, your rhetorical question is pointless. ;)
You have yet to raise a single point of fact in the three comments you've posted on this subject. Repeating mindless rhetoric which has no thread of logic and is impossible to substantiate does not provide any kind of conversation.
Yes, I am a U.S. citizen, btw.
(In what way that is connected to the morality of the military destroying Bibles, I'm not sure).
Ed-
Since our govt will no doubt soon endorse open sodomites in the US armed forces, I think all of us "lunatics" should pull out of the Armed Forces and leave the country to her enemies.
How's that?
The day is coming when Christians in the US armed forces will be called to enforce martial law on fellow Americans, stand by and watch as Israel is attacked, or say "Ma'am! Yes Ma'am!" to a man in a dress.
So I think it's only fair that we pull out of this wicked army and leave the Atheists like yourself to do the fighting.
When this is fulfilled, remember how you argued for it, voted for it, and cursed those who tried to warn you off.
I pray that God would open your eyes to your folly, and soon.
Time is running out for our wicked nation.
God has already brought our economy to the brink, we are infested with Jihadist elements who could activate any day, He has given us over to wicked leadership, and He is striking us with one natural disaster after another.
And you Ed, asked for it.
I think all of us "lunatics" should pull out of the Armed Forces and leave the country to her enemies.
How's that?Sounds good to me...
While there are a lot of conservatives in the military and even a lot of Christian conservatives, not that many are insane.
I could get my head around the not so sane folks not being in the military where they put not only themselves at risk, but the soldiers around them as well - not to mention us back here at home.
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